Banning Prayer in Public Schools Has Led to America's Demise
By Editorial Staff
Published May 1988
by Gary Bergel
A recent statistical analysis by David Barton graphically illustrates how America has plummeted from righteous living, prosperity and success in the last quarter century. Consider the following chart compiled from his study, America: To Pray or Not to Pray. 1
As you might have already noticed on Mr. Barton’s graph, America’s moral decline rapidly accelerated following one event – the U.S. Supreme Court’s removal of prayer from our nation’s schools. On June 25, l962, 39 million students were forbidden to do what they and their predecessors had been doing since the founding of our nation – publicly calling upon the name of the Lord at the beginning of each school day.
The New York school children which prompted the Engel vs. Vitale ruling had simply prayed: “Almighty God, we acknowledge our dependence on Thee and beg Thy blessing over us, our parents, our teachers and our nation.”
America has experienced radical decline in each of the four areas which the children’s prayer touched upon: youth, family, education, national life. Minor recovery has occurred only since 1980 when the election of President Reagan brought forth a renewed emphasis on “traditional” values.
The removal of prayer from our schools was a violation of the third commandment which commands us “not to take the name of the Lord in vain.” By the judicial act of forbidding invocation, the Court audaciously elevated a secularized system of education beyond the authority, reach and blessing of God Himself. Worse than taking the Lord’s sacred name in vain is treating it with contempt, denying it rightful place and stripping it from public use and even from the lips of children. Jesus’ own expressed desire, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them” was also violated by these judges, many of whom were raised in Christian homes.
But there was actually a gross violation of the third commandment by the U.S. Supreme Court a year earlier. A ruling in 1961, I believe, paved the way for stripping the Lord’s name from our children’s lips. In Torcaso vs. Watkins, the court overruled a provision of the Maryland Constitution which made “a declaration of belief in the existence of God” mandatory for holding public office.
Roy R. Torcaso, a Maryland resident and an avowed atheist, was refused a notary public commission when he would not subscribe to the required oath. His case was brought before the U.S. Supreme Court. The Court ruled to sanction atheism and overruled the Maryland Constitution.
Rev. T. Robert Ingram records columnist Felix Morley’s shrewd observations on this 1961 ruling in his study, The World Under God’s Law. Mr. Morley, writing in the Nation’s Business September 1961, pointed out “the absurdity of having an official administer to others oaths in the sanctity of which he does not himself believe.”
The effect of this ruling is not just to eat away at the sacredness of the name of God, but to eliminate the sacredness and thereby the substance of the oath itself. With solemn oaths and binding contracts between individuals removed, the state eventually sits where God ought, and only the state’s cause is held valid. There is no longer an absolute and just legal basis for judging “between a man and his brother,” much less a man and his neighbor (Deuteronomy 1:16, 17). All affairs of life become subject to state, rather than individual control.
Rev. Ingram documents and points out that “a broad, organized attack reaching into high places is under way to remove the third commandment from legal standing in the United States and throughout the world.” He points out that, “the World Court, for example, presumably the new fountain of justice, or a prototype of the socialist dream of world government, has no provision for’taking the name of God’ – no oath.” The Socialist agenda of world domination makes no place for solemn “swearing” between individuals.
Jesus’ teaching on oath-taking recorded in Matthew 5:33-37, while often misinterpreted, is actually a strong affirmation of the third commandment and a clear warning that “the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain” (Exodus 20:7).
Besides forbidding perjury, (calling God to witness a lie) and false swearing, this passage also forbids all rash and unnecessary swearing, and especially warns against promissory oaths – that require a performance. Our “Yes” should be “Yes,” and our “No” should mean “No.” If understood, our word uttered in integrity should of itself be a sufficient and proper bond.
The “evangelical prophet,” Oswald Chambers (1874 – 1917), saw that the empty promises made by so many Christians actually result in great “spiritual leakage.” He admonished his followers: “Always beware of vowing, it is a risky thing. If you promise to do a thing and don’t do it, it means the weakening of your moral nature. We are all so glib in the way we promise and don’t perform and never realize that it is sapping our moral energy.“2
Think then, what happens to a nation rife with perjury, broken marriage covenants, unforgiveness, cults with demonic covenants, extortion, bribery, libel, slander, profanity, hypocrisy, idle talk, and lawsuits initiated solely for revenge and personal gain. We are living witnesses that truly “the Lord does not hold such a nation guiltless.”
Regardless of how the U.S. Supreme Court has ruled, we must each, as Oswald Chambers declared, realize that “God’s laws are not watered down to suit anyone; if God did that He would cease to be God. The moral law never alters for the noblest or the weakest; it remains abidingly and eternally the same.”
After more than 25 years of severe moral decline is it not time to repent, reverence the name of the Lord, reinstitute and keep the third commandment?
1 David Barton, America: To Pray or Not to Pray, (Aledo, TX: Speciality Research Associates).
2 Oswald Chambers, The Best From All His Books, (Oliver-Nelson Books, 1987).
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Your comments are welcome!
While I agree with the finding of a decline in righteous living, I don’t agree that it has anything to do with plubic prayer in school. Kids and teachers can still prayer in school. The school shouldn’t be responsible for teaching our kids to pray. It is our job as parents. The greatest threat to Christianity is not from the outside it’s from the inside. If we do our job right we will return to a more righteous life . We spend too much time worrying about atheists and agnostics. They are not the problem they are opportunties for us to make converts.
LynnPosted by Lynn on 08/20/2008 09:53 AM #
I too believed that out nation is under a great fall due taking prayer out of schools and attempting to take God out of everything we do. Our country has lost morales and respect for God. This country in now the most liberal county, we allow everything to go. After all that God has done to make this the richest land ever, this is how we show our thanks. But do remember – God is not mocked. Every knee shall bow, and every tongue will confess the Jesus Christ is Lord. There will be reprecusions for the choices that have been made without God.
Posted by Charlene on 08/20/2008 03:00 PM #
I believe that Prayer HAS to be brought back in our Public Schools. It will be our Countries ruin, if this was not to happen. What can we, as Christians do about it. I am willing, if shown the way.
Posted by Melanie Myer-Palcsey on 10/07/2008 03:38 PM #
I am going to use this article to do a paper for my World Religion class: Is America a CHRISTian nation?
Posted by Colleen Myrick on 10/08/2008 02:14 PM #
I really liked this artical. I think its wrong to say god is not allowed in school because he is people wear crosses. I recentl got into trouble for praying over my food and i got reall mad.
Isnt americas rules based on christianity?
Posted by Alicia Wailand on 10/15/2008 05:06 PM #
Since the beginning of Christianity the church and Christ’s followers have faced two major problems: being the victims of persecution and being the persecutor. For the first few centuries following Christ’s life, Christians’ lives were in great danger for claiming such a title. However the faith continued to spread by means of peace despite the persecution. This changed in (I think) the third or fourth century when (I believe) Alexander had a vision which changed his faith. Now instead of killing those who confessed Christ as their savior, he killed those who would not accept his faith. Christianity began to spread by means of violence rather than peace. It became the religion of the state, and “Christians” were became not only those who truly believed, but also those who were forced to pretend to for the sake of their lives. The church became the persecutor. Many consider this time to be the fall of Christianity (but that is only an opinion-you decide what to think of it).
The faith’s role as a state religion and persecutor was carried into the medieval times, when the church became so powerful that it was able to massacre Muslims and Jews in the name of Christ through a series of wars called the crusades. This power made the church so corrupted that its leaders made the common people believe they could buy their loved ones’ salvation from purgatory (and the church leaders pocketed the profit from these indulgences).
Though the reformation helped, the church carried its status into the days of colonizing North America, when among other reasons immigrants fled Europe because of such state-led relgious persecution. In the North American continent, people were allowed to worship as they thought fit for Christ, not as the state forced them to.
Based on this principle, when the United States formed the founding fathers explicitly set forth the separation of church and state within the constitution.
Now we debate the morality of prayer in schools. I sympathize with your belief that the U.S. was founded on Christian principles and ought not to stray. But the more important question us followers of Christ must ask is what is truly best for Christianity? History has shown that when Christianity becomes one with the state, corruption and persecution on the part of the church are soon to follow. So as Christians, let us be in the world but not of it, let us hold ourselves to our own moral standards rather than the state holding all to these standards. If the state is to be responsible for regulating morality, and Christianity is to become, as you wish, a state-religion, then followers of Christ surely face the danger of worldly power corrupting our faith.
Posted by Patrick Fischer on 10/18/2008 02:34 AM #
So you think prayer should be back in school? What about those who don’t pray to “God”? Should they be allowed to pray as well – or not because well, christianity is the only way, and you all are too involved in your fiction to pay attention and respect anyone else’s views…
Posted by Cassie on 10/23/2008 02:24 PM #
I am trying to get a group together at our local public schools to pray every week. Its just a prayer walk which only takes a few minutes, but is so awesome, God Moves I promise! I can’t seem to get more than one person to show up. Do you have any suggestions? Also, I would like more information on getting God/prayer back in our schools. Thank you so much
Posted by Tricia on 10/25/2008 10:58 AM #
prayer should be in public schools. who are they {goverment officials} to tell us what we need to do?
Posted by shantal harvey on 10/30/2008 03:02 PM #
I believe the demise of our schools are solely due in part to the removal of prayer in schools.When you remove God you invite everything that is wicked to come in and destroy.Removal of prayer in schools is not a violation of the third amendmant.
Posted by David Green jr. on 10/31/2008 08:05 AM #
Listen, you can’t soley blame depleting morals based on the removal of God from schools. If one truely believed in God or wanted to, there’s always Church to go to. The U.S. Government cannot inforce or support the church and it’s ways. I have no set religion for I am unsure which is the right one for me. I believe that morals is a family constructed issue. You cannot blame the school for bad morals, blame the household in which the students derive from. If anythinf, there’s still private school out there to send our kids. But I’m still saying, morals is a family touched and tought issue, not the school.
Posted by Erik on 11/11/2008 03:12 PM #
The decline in morals are not a direct factor with the removal of God from public school. You people are running on a one track mind if you believe so. Public school houses many cultures and its our moral duties to tolerate these differences. You’re going against what you preach if you can’t tolerate the differences of others. Aren’t you suppose to respect the rights of others? God is a powerful being that resides in us all, but only if we accept him. Am I right? Not everyone can and therefore we must tolerate that and accept it, not force it upon others. You’ll be like the first spanish settlers who came over here and forced christianity upon the natives. Brutes. Don’t be like them.
Posted by Erik on 11/13/2008 01:36 AM #
True, with the lack of God in public places, chaos has filled in that gap. All the kids in public school are either arrogant to what higher being there is or just doesn’t seem to care. The lose of faith is breaking the support beams holding this country together. Something has to change!
Posted by James on 11/13/2008 10:50 AM #
Being a student in the “religion-free” public school system, I can tell you first hand that it is not as terrible as you seem to believe it is. My friends and I don’t runaround like heathens and we aren’t in need of saving. We have a moment of silence each morning which many people use for prayer. We are allowed to discuss God, even encouraged depending on the situation. We discussed both evolution and creation in my biology class and nothing terrible happened. It is not quite the catastrophe that you seem to envision.
Also I am researching school prayer for a government paper and was going to use this as a source until I realized how incorrect some of your facts are, making me question the validity of your other statements.
Posted by Emily on 11/24/2008 09:00 PM #
I think our country started to go down hill, if you are convinced it is, when ‘under God’ was added to the Pledge of Allegiance or when ‘In God We Trust’ was added to money, you know, in the late 50’s. Look at the data, there is a clear correlation. We “elected” a president who thinks he is ordained by God for his position and we have 9/11. Cause and effect people, cause and effect.
Posted by Tommy on 12/11/2008 02:23 PM #
From most of the comments on this issue, one would think that nothing bad ever happened in school before prayer was banned. Whether prayer is allowed in schools or not shouldn’t determine how “Godly” a person is. Isn’t it the job of parents to teach morals? Isn’t it the job of our religious leaders to teach scripture? When did this become the government’s job?
Posted by J. Michael Knightbridge on 12/12/2008 03:00 PM #
Let’s not blame the lack of prayer in school against the late Madeleine O’hare. She and all of her followers (atheist/agnostics) are still in the minority – there are a lot more Christians (or at least a lot more claiming to be). And when I was in school no one stopped me from praying when I wanted to pray. If all the Christians in America decided to stop at 10:00 AM on Thursday and joined in a collective prayer – who’s going to stop them? How bad do we want to pray in school – that’s the question?
How bad did Daniel in the Bible want to pray? Bad enough that he was willing to put his life on the line. How many Christians “really” want prayer in school? How many are willing to go to prison for standing up? And if they put all the Christians in prison for praying – then who will pay the taxes to support the prisons?
Rosa Parks did not want to give up her seat to a white man on a Montgomery public bus one day – and was willing to go to jail to support her principles.
Christians need to stop complaining and acting like victims of the “system.” We are victors – not victims. And I can pray anytime I please – anywhere I please – and no one can stop me. They can kill me, they can put me in jail – but they can’t stop me from praying – in the school, on the bus, at the store or in the football stadium.
The government or O’Hare or no one else took prayer out of the school. Christians just simply stopped praying – period!
Christians, stop blaming the government and the atheist for taking prayer out of the schools. Fact: if you’re a “person of prayer” – then no one can stop you from praying unless you give them permission to do so.
Posted by Bruce Blackwell on 01/07/2009 12:43 AM #
I appreciated all the comments on this article. Some great perspectives. Non the less I think that the decision to remove prayer from schools was spiritually significant to our nation. Of course no one really knows what another is praying privately, nor should they. Of course many who pray public prayers in school or anywhere else niether believe what they pray nor live it out in thier daily lives. The significance of this ruling is that it “officially” removes the practice of invocation of God’s presence, power and guidance over us. Our national decline in morality was in place long before this decision made it official. The ruling simply puts an official stamp on our national desire to rule ourselves and not be ruled by the creator of the universe. The key to changing all this, if it even can be done (and I have my doubts) is for those who claim to love God and are called Christians, to look in our own hearts and ask God to forgive our sins. The sins of us Christians are the reason for removal of God’s blessing and the precursor to offical rulings like the one in 1962. If our hearts are broken over sin, and we pray to be humbled, find God, and completely give our wills to Him, then God Himself will reverse these trends. If not, our nation will perish. I expect we are not far from that day.
Posted by Thomas J. McLaughlin on 01/08/2009 09:29 AM #
I believe that prayer being banned from the public school systems was by far the most uneducated and most of all immoral thing that could have been done. Not only has it affected the schools it has also affected the homes and the homes and its inhabitants. Me being a young teen in school, have witnessed first hand to this and i can truly say that prayer should be allowed in schools. Every one does not have to pray if you choose not to then that is your choice. Please don’t let the ignorance of 10 people ruin a nations well being!!!
Posted by Quentin on 01/13/2009 12:26 PM #
Being a former student of The Reverend T. Robert Ingram’s St. Thomas Episcopal School, I have first hand knowledge of the make and meter of this man.
It is truly unfortunate that this John Birch Society member and extremist would be quoted as a viable source.
Couldn’t you find some other source to support your views?
I suggest that in order for your position to have more credibility, that you investigate your sources more thoroughly before you quote them.
Lilly
Posted by Lilly on 01/23/2009 10:08 PM #
America is and always will be America. In God we trust. Prayer should have never been taken out of Americas schools. We do have thankfully a veriaty of people and if they do not want or there parents do not want them to pray in school then don“t. But I feel that certain people they need to remember or be informed that they are here because of our God or whom ever you would like to call him. He is and always will be. Thank you.Me.
Posted by Diana Leary on 01/29/2009 02:25 PM #
Why can’t prayer be done at home? Why must prayer ( a private and personal act) be done in public in an institution based on education, not religion. I dont pray, i don’t even believe in god, but i have mostly religious friends and i do not ever try to take away or challenge they’re beliefs and they act the same to me. Having prayer in a public school acts against seperation of church and state, if you want prayer in school go to catholic school! If you want your child to learn with the influence of religion dont put them in public schools. Do not bring personal matters into a public institution.
Posted by Justin on 02/08/2009 12:16 AM #
The biggest problem in public schools are problems that the schools CANNOT solve. The biggest problems in public schools stem from problems in the home. The reason God has been expelled from school is because He has been expelled from more homes than I would like to believe. Many of these kids come to school with absolutely no work ethic, no moral compass, and no sense of respect for anyone including themselves. I find it hard to believe that these kids are being raised in good, God-fearing homes.
To make matters worse, the school districts (who must shoulder their fair share of the blame) do not impose any real behavioral expectations for fear of lawsuits being brought by dysfunctional people who raising their children to be, well, dysfunctional people. The idea of consequences has gone out the window in favor of “self-esteem”. Let me explain why I believe self-esteem is a fallacy. No one on the face of the earth gets to determine the value of any person (including himself/herself). God alone has defined our value and He is NEVER wrong. God has determined that each one of us is worth His coming to earth in human form, dying for all of us, and coming back to life so that we may spend etermity with Him. That’s where the value of a human being is found.
The argument for public funding of schools has always been that it benefits our society to have an educated populace. My question is whether that purpose is being served. Kids who are disciplinary problems are eating up all of the resources leaving the other kids to receive a third rate education. Our high school seniors are, on the average, on par with other developed nations’ 8th graders. Therefore, our tax dollars are being used to subsidize substandard education.
Additionally, the schools are continuously trying to remove the possibility of failure from the equation. Without failure, we have no objective standard by which to measure success (which renders success meaningless). Without God, we have no objective standard by which we can condemn evil (rendering everything, including evil, acceptable).
Posted by gman5284 on 02/08/2009 09:55 PM #
somebody said that they saw America go down hill when we put, In God We Trust on our money. I just think it Started going down hill when they abolished group Prayer in schools in the 60’s. We all have choices if you made yours to stay out or religion or Christianity then that is up to you. I wont tell you your wrong but we all will be judged one day and if you deny Jesus he will deny you in front of the Lord.
Prayer being removed from school is just the leading indicator of a nation that is ‘Falling Away’ from Jehovah. It is just another sign of moral/spiritual decay of the American. And the disasters we see today are simply God’s finger writing on the wall: Mene, mene, Tekel, Upharsin; that is, God has weighed America in the balances, and we’ve been found wanting. No wonder 50 million babies have been aborted since 1973. No wonder hundreds of earthquakes have popped up in ‘divers places’. No wonder Hurricane Katrina smote New Orleans just before a gay rally! No wonder our economy is nose-diving! THink About it! God’s speaking to us. We can ignore Him or listen to Him. Just know He will judge the wicked. Whew! I’m ready.
Posted by Andrew on 03/09/2009 11:16 PM #
Really? This is completely ridiculous. I guess i could play the blame game like most christians do but i won’t. You aren’t a sociologist… you don’t know what causes moral decline…
Posted by Jake on 03/25/2009 11:29 AM #
What I would say is that taking prayer out of schools indicated a social revolution. As a Christian, I believe prayer affects our lives. However, I also recognize that this was part of the moral decline. It was a barometer of the social revolution that began around this time.
Posted by Jay Rogers on 03/25/2009 11:41 AM #
Wow, here we go again. Christians blaming moral decline on prayer being taken out of school. How pathetic. Are we so weak minded? Japan, where no one prays at school, has the lowest crime rate of any developed nation. I mean, c’mon! Even Jesus was against school prayer. Matt 6:5-6 Anyways, children can pray in school if they want to. That right hasn’t been taken away, they merely need to keep it to themselves. It just isn’t fair to have prayer required in schools. What about the other children who believe in a different religion or have no religion? But, of course. These types of Christians only care about themselves and THEIR beliefs. To hell with everyone else. Inconsiderate bigots.
Posted by Oh LORD on 03/29/2009 03:46 PM #
America’s schools have been on the decline ever-since School Prayer was removed in 1962. Our schools now rank near or at the bottom of the industrialized nations of the world. Christian Schools and home school kids rate in the top 98% in college entrance exams. Our government has failed to educate our kids and should get out of the education business.
Removing school prayer was an unconstitutional act of the US Supreme Court. As Ronald Reagan said in 1984, the First Amendment was not to protect the people from religion but to protect the people from the government. Learn more at www.free2pray.info
Posted by Charles Steele on 03/30/2009 01:54 PM #
how can people with different religons practice there belifes but we cant pray in school
Posted by michael on 04/01/2009 12:32 PM #
This article seems to be, like many religious studies, based on belief, rather than fact. There is no evidence to prove anything here. When it comes to things payed by taxes, the commandments have nothing to do with it. Church and state are seperate. The Bill of Rights comes before the commandments. What would you do if your child was forced to go to school and pray to allah and various intervals throughout the day?
Where are the statistics to back this up? Where’s the one about the countries that have had prayer banned from schools for far longer than the United States, yet have a better economy and lower crime rate? How do you know what you’re talking about? Stating opinions as facts isn’t acceptable.
I am indeed a Christian, and I do believe that the removal of prayer in public schools has effected our society today. Think about it….if we really did have our “freedoms” then I would not have been told that I can only hold my prayer group once a week now as oppossed to every day like we used to. My school principals told me that it was because it had grown to be too big. All in all I thought that was the point in the first place,to reach my fellow peers. My parents and I fought it for a while, but we never could really get enough support for any change to really happen and I don’t want to drive a wedge between my family and the school board so that prayer will be totally removed,because I still have two younger brothers to think about here.So,I really do not appreciate one of the comments made earlier about how we CAN pray whenever and wherever we want, beacause I (unlike that person apparently)honestly have been down that road.
Posted by Kierstin on 04/15/2009 12:52 PM #
To all you known belivers who fail to acknowledge the word of God, I feel so sorry for your soul because oneday, it will be judged and if you have not accepted God in your life and repented for all sins, Hell will be your eternity and Hell is a non- stop burning show. Prayer is what gives us strength to communicate with God and shame on anyone who thinks their help comes from anything else besides Him. God gives us life and He is the only one that can take it away. Once you’re lying flat on your back in a coffin, then all chances are over to make it right with God. God gives us all choices and we as human beings must make the right choices because everyone doesnot get a second chance at life. Look around the world today, it’s truly falling apart. It’s falling apart because some people are doing their own sinful things not giving an account to God. Time is winding down and He is soon to come. If your soul isn’t right when He comes, then that will be a sad day indeed. So all of you non- belivers, you have a chance now to get it together. Don’t let death catch you creeping. Be blessed!!
Posted by Melissa Hudson on 04/21/2009 03:21 PM #
Amen brother. AMen
Posted by joe on 04/23/2009 11:05 AM #
I am an atheist. In my opinion, if someone wants to pray, let them. As long as they aren’t a distraction. But forcing children to pray is ridiculous.
Posted by jordan on 05/11/2009 04:17 PM #
I know first hand that prayer in public schools is not dead. I am a christian but I attend a public, secular college university. I attended a sports awards banquet last night. Before the meal we had and the ceremony, an athletic staff member got up and delivered a public invocation, or blessing, for the meal and the ceremony. Surprisingly enough, nobody stood up in anger or hatred. Nobody got up shouting pleas of detest. those who wanted to participated in the prayer, and those who didnt simply sat there in silence and showed respect for those who did participate. As hard as the government tries, they will never full banish religious practices in schools. God is too powerful and so are his believers
Posted by Zack on 05/15/2009 12:46 PM #
Correlation does not equal causation.
Posted by Randall on 05/17/2009 12:13 AM #
If a 5 min prayer in our schools was so powerful as to have made such a differance in our nation then how powerful would it be if families committed to at least 5 minutes of prayer together in their homes daily?
2 Ch.7:14 says “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.”
Posted by dodie on 06/06/2009 11:12 AM #
I Don’t believe Prayer should be banned from school. yes it is a private and personal thing but students should have the ability to do it when they wish. Look at it from not a religious point. For instance sports, people dont have to play the sport but some sign up. Prayer should be an option but not completly banned from schools.
Posted by Emma on 06/10/2009 11:46 AM #
Prayer should be back in school to give these kids that are going up a sense of belief, trust and fear of God, because kids these days think they could do anything they want to and get away with it.
Posted by Entzy Martelly on 06/18/2009 12:17 AM #
Prayer is NOT banned from public schools. Read some laws before snap-judgements are made.The staff of the school cannnot force or deny anybody the ability to pray.As for moral decline, maybe bible-bashing your child caused rebellion. Children should have the right to meet God on their own terms.
Posted by Drex Williams on 07/08/2009 01:31 AM #
Who are you all to say that we need God in our lives. This entire article is ridiculous. You are still allowed to pray in school as long as it doesn’t affect the education that the school system is trying to give our children. You can pray quietly whenever you want and does the bible not say in:
Matthew 6:5-8
“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing
in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth,
they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close
the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is
done in secret, will reward you. And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like
pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like
them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.”
You can pray whenever you want. Church may also be a good time for that kind of stuff.
You cannot expect to hold up class time and such and force other people of other religions to listen to Christian prayers, Jewish prayers, Hindu, Muslim whatever it is not right to force people who do not share the same feelings about religion as you to sit there and listen to you pray is insensitive to the beliefs of others. You cannot be so ignorant to say that your religion no matter what it is, is the correct religion there is no proof that it is the correct one. If there was a correct religion and we knew about it then everyone would most likely be it, don’t you think. Why are there so many religions in the world. Because no one knows what the right one is. Look at it this way. How many religions have been founded or made off the words of one man. All one man has to do is get people to follow him and how does he do that. He instills fear into people. People are always afraid. Always thinking of death and what could or won’t happen next. Now if your scared enough and all of a sudden in what seems like coincidence, someone comes up to you and says hey you know what. I can save you I can save you from what’s to come. But you must donate so that I can build a better platform to get the word out that I can save people you must help me you must donate and don’t forget, don’t do this … this and this… or else you will not go anywhere remotely nice when you die. You know this sort of thing gets to me when people think that they are right about they’re religion or topics. Ignorance is truly bliss. Now in lieu of that last statement I am not saying that I am right in anyway shape or form. I believe that everyone should be allowed to believe whatever they want to believe and pray to whomever they want to pray. But what does bug me and what I do feel is unacceptable is when people try to impose they’re religious beliefs FORCFULLY on someone else. Who do you think that you talking to a non-religious person is going to get them to change or believe what you believe. Last time I checked you were supposed to let God do that kind of work. You know about 60 % of religious people that I have personally met are hypocrites they preach about this and they preach about that and then once they are done putting on there Sunday best they go home drink a fifth and beat their kids. Now I understand that there is GOOD and BAD in everything. Not all religious folks are good people. Not all prisoners are bad people. Hell not all bad people are BAD people. Maybe just a bad choice or two has led them down a path that they did not intend to be on. I highly doubt most bad people as kids are thinking to themselves, “ You know what, when I grow up I don’t want to be a fireman, I want to hurt people”. That is the kind of thing that parents are supposed to be teaching their kids not to do. Parents are the ones that are supposed to be teaching they’re kids values and morals and what is right and wrong. O’ and side note all those parents that think that “Angry Music & Video Games” are the root of all evil and its what’s causing your children to become evil and lash out at society. YOU ARE IDIOTS. I apologize, but your child may be playing violent video games and what not, but when they go out and rape or shoot someone. It will not be because of the video game it will be your lack of parenting, maybe you should have hit them those last few times. And if any of you are saying “Well what about the belt?” there is a difference between getting a belt to the butt and physically assaulting your child multiple times with your fists.
SOCIETY SIDE NOTE:
The reason that society is bad today is not because of the lack of Fear for God. It is because of what our society has become. Our society has become so concentrated on how people FEEL. That if someone is FEELING bad and they don’t FEEL like going to work today then they don’t. In today’s society it has become acceptable to avoid all sense of responsibility. I know that more than half of you remember when you were young if you didn’t do what your father told you, you were going to get the belt, and you know what you sure never made that mistake again. Now, you even show your child a belt with the intention of hitting him/her and your own child can sue you. People today are basically in my mind, for a lack of a better word soft. I remember my Grandfather telling stories of the horrible things that he was forced to do in WWII things that no one should ever have to go through, NO ONE (at 19 mind you). Yet you walk down the street or listen to the 18-24ish yr olds today and they are complaining about having to work more than 6 hours at a decently paying job.
Ok if anyone has actually read this entire thing I thank you for your time and I apologize if I have jumped around a lot.
In conclusion, I personally believe that forcing prayer upon our children in the class room is wrong. If you want prayer forced send your child to a religious specific school. If it is a public school it should be a place where all cultures and all religions and all people should be able to come and feel comfortable in order to do what they are there to do which I’m sorry is not to learn about religion. It is to learn and become educated and become the successful people that we all know they can be. Forcing your religion on someone else is wrong and if your faith is not strong enough to withstand any of the statements above without you becoming frustrated or enraged, then maybe you should visit your local religious establishment and pray for open mindedness and patience. Thank you for your time.
-Mick
Posted by Mick on 07/13/2009 12:16 AM #
Prayer is NOT banned from public schools.The catch is that school staff members can’t lead prayers.Bible verses CAN be taught in school, but there has to be equal references to other religious faiths.I do believe in God, and I do pray, but how I choose to communicate with him is no one else’s business, and it should be the same everywhere.Prayer, on the other hand should not be enforced or denied in schools.Go ahead and let the children pray, as long as its not disruptive to the learning process.That’s what they are ther for, right?
Posted by Drex Williams on 07/15/2009 02:06 AM #
Individual prayer is not banned from schools, but school-sanctioned group prayer is, and for a damn good reason.
Not permitting group prayer sessions in schools is not the same as kicking god out of schools. Not at ALL. And you are all doing a huge disrespect to people that have actually been put through pain and killed over their religious beliefs in other less-free nations, and in other places in the past. To play this debate off as some kind of religious persecution only weakens your message to anyone with a shred of common sense.
There’s absolutely nothing stopping kids from bringing God into schools with them in their hearts and minds. But public schools are an open, secular institution. If you feel that your kid isn’t getting enough of God, you need to stop blaming schools and instead step up to the plate yourself.
Posted by David on 08/04/2009 01:47 AM #
It is the parents and church’s job to teach children about beliefs and religion.
Posted by Mark Pogue on 08/07/2009 08:17 PM #
This is a very interesting topic. @ The person who posted as “Oh Lord” you are taking that verse out of context those verses were referring specifically to the religious sect of that time who use to love doing these things in public so that they would be seen and recognize by men. This was an issue about “motive” an issue of the heart. If the issue was about doing things in public then why did Jesus and his disciples performed miracle’s in public. He even prayed to the father in public when he was about to raise lazarus from the dead. So it’s vey important not to take scriptures out of context thats how we end up in trouble and form all these wierd doctrines. Now you mentioned about Japan. Yeah they might have all these things going for them that you mentioned but you fail to include one piece of information that they have one of the highest suicide rate to the point that the government is helpless and they don’t know what to do. read it here http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-05-29-japan-suicide_N.htm , And this whole thing about Christian being weak minded I find it interetsing that you say such harsh words and yet you read a book that is only designed for christians and you gave a scripture makes me wonder but I will say this there is nothing weak minded about a christian because we have the mind of Christ (1 corinthians 2:16) and there is nothing weak about him. Judge not(matthew 7 v1) and you won’t be Judged
Posted by K on 08/13/2009 09:53 AM #
I don’t think just because there is some kids that don’t believe in God at school that God and prayer should be taken out of them
Posted by SAKI on 08/20/2009 06:13 PM #
I believe that jesus is the son of god,and I believe that god sent his only son to die on the cross for your sins. I really don`t care what you think,or if you believe or not.You,who does not believe live your life your way. You will be judged one day,wether you believe that or not.I will keep spreading the word of GOD,and if you don`t like it,well thats OK with me .I`m not even going to feel sorry for you.As you get older and lay on your death bed,I bet you`ll be asking for GODS forgivness,but if he doesn`t,I will not feel sorry for you.It wouldn`t hurt you to at least give a little thought to God and his son. It may be your last chance.If you don`t want to acknowledge me ,thats fine,but at least I tried.
Posted by gaetano on 08/22/2009 10:56 AM #
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I truly believe that this nation is in the mess that it is in because God have been taking out of the school system this nation was built on Gods word, and were God is not being praised and worshiped there will be problems and some don’t seem to understand that, Adam and Eve received from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. so the world took on that understanding, that's why God sent His word to bring us back to the truth of His word not what the government said, it is what God said in His word
Posted by Evangelist James e Chance on 07/08/2008 09:30 PM #